Curse

Yukito Kunisaki · Aug 23, 2006, 07:06 AM // 07:06

To all the jerks, losers, and n00bs who told me you can't beat Hell's Precipice without human monks, take a gander at these...

Beat this Hell's Precipice, WITH NO HUMAN BACKUP WHATSOEVER F00LS!!!

http://ourworld.cs.com/OmniStrataStudio/gw001.jpg
http://ourworld.cs.com/OmniStrataStudio/gw002.jpg
http://ourworld.cs.com/OmniStrataStudio/gw003.jpg
http://ourworld.cs.com/OmniStrataStudio/gw004.jpg
http://ourworld.cs.com/OmniStrataStudio/gw005.jpg

And here's a little thing I took to commemorate my old guildmates before real-life set in and the guild dispersed... 1 HOUR TEAM ARENA!!!

http://ourworld.cs.com/OmniStrataStudio/1HrBattle.jpg

I don't care what anyone can say or do, those of you who keep looking for monks and say you HAVE to have human monks or what to beat the last mission in Prophecies can simply look at these pics, and stfu... [had to do some resizing due to some server 500k size restraint but they're all perfectly readable...]

Those of you who'd like me to lead your party into Hell's Precipice to beat it, just pm me in game. My current W/N build is named "Yukinari Sasaki"

Anyone else got any cool [SOLO CAN BE DONE] pics? Thunderhead Keep comes to mind, that's gotta be a REAL nice achievement to have especially since you get pincer attacked for the most part...

Sorry, the sickening complaints of people telling me "You can't do this mission without monks ya n00b..." got me going and I figured, what the hey? ^_^

If you don't know how I got two elites in there, you're gonna have to fig that one out

Yanman.be · Aug 23, 2006, 07:09 AM // 07:09

That's not hard...solo means solo. Not with henchies.

Mera Regila · Aug 23, 2006, 07:12 AM // 07:12

It's actually extremely easy to hench Hell's Precipice. That's why i hate it, an easily henchable mission as the LAST MISSION in the entire game??? No point at all.

Yukito Kunisaki · Aug 23, 2006, 07:15 AM // 07:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mera Regila

It's actually extremely easy to hench Hell's Precipice. That's why i hate it, an easily henchable mission as the LAST MISSION in the entire game??? No point at all.

Reason being, most people assume you HAVE to have this to beat the game and I would be shouting: LFM ANY MEMBERS, CAN BEAT GAME WITH NO HUMAN MONKS!...

And then the majority say 'stfu' and shtuff...

You SMART people know it's easy, but I'm just pointing out to the 'rest' of the 'well learned' that they should stop assuming that me yelling, "NEED NO HUMAN MONKS" doesn't mean I'm setting up suicide runs...

ubermancer · Aug 23, 2006, 07:28 AM // 07:28

Wait, are you trying to say that people who use pick-up groups DONT know what they are talking about!?

gojensen · Aug 23, 2006, 08:22 AM // 08:22

I managed to hench Hell's aswell. I'm not gonna say it was easy though! It was hellishly annyoing... especially since I wanted the bonus (how come that is harder than the rest? well, mostly since the bonus giver often died before I could reach him...)

And TK without human monks. (Had 1 other human warrior with me...)... The missions were I think henchies really begin to fail is those that are limited by time, or where you must defeat one wave before the next one comes along... for that they are simply not smart enough and don't deal enough damage. IMO.

Arkantos · Aug 23, 2006, 08:36 AM // 08:36

Sorry, beating any mission in prophecies with henchies isnt anything special.

Rera · Aug 23, 2006, 12:57 PM // 12:57

I honestly think some of you guys need to stop pulling the 1337face everytime someone posts something that even remotely resembles bragging. It seems as though you guys are so concerned about your own perceived superiority that you want to make sure everyone knows that X achievement was "nothing special" etc. etc. even if *it wasn't the OP's intention to claim that it was special*.

In this case, the OP is refuting the commonly-encountered claim that Hell's Precipice cannot be henched. He does not say anywhere that this is at all special - in fact, it would *help* his case if this were *not* special because it would indicate that anyone can do it, and therefore there really is no need for human monks.

ValidusMonachus · Aug 23, 2006, 01:01 PM // 13:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkantos

Sorry, beating any mission in prophecies with henchies isnt anything special.

True true.

Arkantos · Aug 23, 2006, 01:02 PM // 13:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rera

In this case, the OP is refuting the commonly-encountered claim that Hell's Precipice cannot be henched. He does not say anywhere that this is at all special - in fact, it would *help* his case if this were *not* special because it would indicate that anyone can do it, and therefore there really is no need for human monks.

You can say the same about any mission. There's no point in posting something you did with henchies, because everybody knows that you can hench basically everything in pve.

ubermancer · Aug 23, 2006, 03:57 PM // 15:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkantos

You can say the same about any mission. There's no point in posting something you did with henchies, because everybody knows that you can hench basically everything in pve.

Ive seen screenies of a guy who beat THK with an empty skillbar and 7 henchies.

DeanBB · Aug 23, 2006, 03:57 PM // 15:57

I beat it both with a wa/mo (cleave + eviscerate = nice!) and a monk (smiting) with just henchies. My other times thru have been with guildies.

Really what is needed for this mission or any of the tougher missions is just understanding of the mission and enemies. Know what you face and when, know when to pull or avoid patrols, when to retreat, etc and the difficulty is greatly reduced.

I could not have done it the first 2-3 times I went thru it which was with groups and attempts with henchies, but with understanding came victory.

Rebirth makes it much easier to complete so I recommend any "just henchies" teams to have it along, change your 2nd to monk if necessary.

Hollerith · Aug 23, 2006, 04:02 PM // 16:02

Whenever someone claims you can't hench a particular mission, they have not yet realized that most players are worse than henchies.

Especially with Hell's Precipice. Whenever I play there's like 4 people in Hell's Precipice, and they're all afk. I've had to hench that mission with half my characters.

Pick Me · Aug 23, 2006, 05:17 PM // 17:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hollerith

Whenever someone claims you can't hench a particular mission, they have not yet realized that most players are worse than henchies.

Especially with Hell's Precipice. Whenever I play there's like 4 people in Hell's Precipice, and they're all afk. I've had to hench that mission with half my characters.

I somewhat disagree with you. People who say you can't hench a mission means they themselves are not very good and need humans to aid them. I've henched a few missions, but most of them I've been in PUGs. In some cases, a human monk is almost needed (only to heal stupid NPCs because henchies won't). People tend to be a little reckless (including myself) and need a monk to heal them (NPCs don't always heal, let alone fast enough), so people need to either relax and take it easy with henchies, or they refuse to change their ways and desparately need a good monk to help them out.

Congrats on beating Hell's Precepice with henchies.

Yukito Kunisaki · Aug 23, 2006, 06:14 PM // 18:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pick Me

I somewhat disagree with you. People who say you can't hench a mission means they themselves are not very good and need humans to aid them. I've henched a few missions, but most of them I've been in PUGs. In some cases, a human monk is almost needed (only to heal stupid NPCs because henchies won't). People tend to be a little reckless (including myself) and need a monk to heal them (NPCs don't always heal, let alone fast enough), so people need to either relax and take it easy with henchies, or they refuse to change their ways and desparately need a good monk to help them out.

Congrats on beating Hell's Precepice with henchies.

Thanks, and yes, I'm not bragging, I'm just telling these know-it-all people, [who call me n00b for claiming monkless mission win capabilities] that it can be doable and what really saddens me is that monks seem to have all but ceased to exist...

I ONLY see monk-bots farming stupid places for easy money with people in slave shops probably doing it or what not horrors of this world be done...

I used to think human monks are good but every time I tried to earn my Prot. of Tyria award, A MONK KEEPS GOING AFK AT THE STUPIDEST TIMES. [after 5 tries with humans [monk henchies or human monks, no go in either case] I just said to hell with it and didn't realize it but it seems true...]

9/10 pugs in my experience are stupid noobs who don't know what it means when a warrior yells, "RETREAT!!!" [the text, not the skill] and then books it out of a fight that's OBVIOUSLY going down the toilet... They should reword the skill retreat where if more than 2 party members have 50% hp or less, then it can be activated... Waiting for someone to die before yelling retreat is a bit extreme for me...

Yeah, 90% of pugs suck for me, maybe you others are much luckier than I or I'm not trying hard enough [I have a life and don't have 10 mins. to waste in the waiting area for a monk who'll potentially just go afk to be an ass for no apparent reason....]

I need to do research on hench-way, sounds good.

Humans suck as teammates....

mega_jamie · Aug 23, 2006, 06:21 PM // 18:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkantos

You can say the same about any mission. There's no point in posting something you did with henchies, because everybody knows that you can hench basically everything in pve.

Not to insult a mod but,

Clearly there is a point in posting that, because clearly some people don't know it

Pick Me · Aug 23, 2006, 06:58 PM // 18:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yukito Kunisaki

Thanks, and yes, I'm not bragging, I'm just telling these know-it-all people, [who call me n00b for claiming monkless mission win capabilities] that it can be doable and what really saddens me is that monks seem to have all but ceased to exist...

I ONLY see monk-bots farming stupid places for easy money with people in slave shops probably doing it or what not horrors of this world be done...

I used to think human monks are good but every time I tried to earn my Prot. of Tyria award, A MONK KEEPS GOING AFK AT THE STUPIDEST TIMES. [after 5 tries with humans [monk henchies or human monks, no go in either case] I just said to hell with it and didn't realize it but it seems true...]

9/10 pugs in my experience are stupid noobs who don't know what it means when a warrior yells, "RETREAT!!!" [the text, not the skill] and then books it out of a fight that's OBVIOUSLY going down the toilet... They should reword the skill retreat where if more than 2 party members have 50% hp or less, then it can be activated... Waiting for someone to die before yelling retreat is a bit extreme for me...

Yeah, 90% of pugs suck for me, maybe you others are much luckier than I or I'm not trying hard enough [I have a life and don't have 10 mins. to waste in the waiting area for a monk who'll potentially just go afk to be an ass for no apparent reason....]

I need to do research on hench-way, sounds good.

Humans suck as teammates....

You obviously had bad PUGs.

I've been in groups where they knew exactly what they were doing (I was totally clueless with the mission) and we did missions like they were nothing. I've been in groups where people do not talk, or pay attention and we get crushed. I find that communication is a big part of doing well in PUGs. If no one communicates, then trying to be tactiful will cause lots of people to scream and whine and curse, because others don't know what you were planning on.

I always (unless told not to) announce what I'm doing (I'm casting WoH on Mystery Meat). This is so people know I'm not just standing there, or afk, or not paying attention or wasting my time healing someone if someone else is going to heal them.

Now, I do agree with you, when people don't notice that half the party is dead and the group needs to retreat and regroup (even writing arrows and pointing to a safe area on the mini-map). So the group ends up dead, but not all people are like that. Please don't give up on the humans, they have flaws, but they do learn (eventually).

Hollerith · Aug 23, 2006, 07:10 PM // 19:10

Just to clarify my above generalization, people say missions aren't henchable because:

Their PUGs have had consecutive failures.
They believe henchmen are worse than a real player with 8 random skills on their bar.

Using that logic, missions where PUGs continuously fail will therefore also fail if using henchmen.

Age · Aug 23, 2006, 08:23 PM // 20:23

It is always reasurring to have atleast 1 human Monk with a better skill bar than those of the henchies.There is one mission that really can't be henched and that is the RoF we used Hench Monk and they keep diening in the lava pits I had to keep ressing them all the time with my Warrior.I find I can't work with henchies in a mission as the mission are set for coop play between real ppl not just to use henchies solely I did hench Dragons Lair although it took longer.I gather that mission took longer than you thought with henches.

I play Monk and am better than they are don't question me.

Rera · Aug 23, 2006, 09:29 PM // 21:29

The truth about henchmen is that they reflect the skill of the player(s). The typical GW player has bad experiences with henchmen because the person is incompetent at playing even their own single character, and has no business leading a group of 7 other idiot-AI party members. Good players (or, at least decent ones) have no problem beating most or all of the game with henchies because they understand the game mechanics (either conciously or subconciously), they're familiar with the monsters and their skills, and they understand how henchmen work.

Quote:

I've been in groups where they knew exactly what they were doing (I was totally clueless with the mission) and we did missions like they were nothing.

This isn't to flame you at all, but in my opinion this situation occurs too often. Good, experienced people that essentially do the mission for less experienced players is a disservice to everyone. The inexperienced person completes the mission, but doesn't really gain much understanding of how the mission works, the appropriate strategies to use, and most importantly, they don't actually get any better, because they were just led around by people who already knew how to beat the mission. Example: The first time I did Vizunah Square, I was essentially run through it by my friend. He assembled the 'perfect' (cookie-cutter) group, he lead the group, and we completed the mission with a master's rating with absolutely no problems. Problem is, I didn't really learn anything. Oh, I knew the basics - there are areas where you just stand there, afflicted spawn in waves from certain points, you kill them all, there's a boss, and then you run to the next seige area, fighting am fah along the way. I'm still very thankful to my friend for essentially doing it for me, because at that time it was important to do things quickly and smoothly. However, in order to really *understand* the mission to the point where I could confidently lead a group through it, I had to go back and do this mission with henchmen, by myself, and work through each fight.

Maybe some of you are extremely fast at picking up things and only need to have the mission done for you, a single time, for you to learn everything there is to know. I highly doubt that's true for anyone, but even if such a player exists, they are the extreme minority. For everyone else, having the mission done for you by people who know what they are doing can prevent you from learning what you should, and I highly recommend everyone to try to beat the game on their own at least once.